I am sure I am preaching to the choir here, but I have a need to say this:
Posted by dancing digits on September 4, 2025, 12:08 am
Where do Americans place their priorities and what do they believe to be important? What value does the Constitution hold for Americans? This isn't just a political matter - it goes far beyond it.
Maybe there are those who do trust Trump in this situation and on this issue (though I haven't a clue why). . . but he is grabbing power that he does not legally possess. He is trampling on the Constitution and the spirit in which it was created. If he succeeds, this sets a precedent for future Presidents. Who will they be and do you trust them? How do you even know who they will be and what kind of President they will make? The balance of power is being altered in such a way that it is no longer balanced among the three branches of government.
American Constitution Society
Issue Brief September 2020 American Constitution Society | 1899 L Street, NW, 2nd Floor | Washington, DC 20036 www.acslaw.org
The President’s Legal Authority to Commit Troops Domestically Under the Insurrection Act Harold Hongju Koh & Michael Loughlin
Issue Brief September 2020 American Constitution Society | 1899 L Street, NW, 2nd Floor | Washington, DC 20036 www.acslaw.org
I. The June 1 Claim On June 1, 2020, President Donald Trump suggested that he could deploy U.S. troops to American cities over the objection of state and city leaders, without a court order, and unrelated to the purpose of protecting civil rights. “If a city or state refuses to take the actions that are necessary to defend the life and property of their residents,” he said, “then I will deploy United States military and quickly solve the problem for them.”
II. Insurrection Act Analysis A. Background At the outset, it should be noted that the Insurrection Act was not enacted in a vacuum. The Constitution and statutory Posse Comitatus restrictions impose a general constitutional presumption against the Executive’s use of military force in American city streets. The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 (presently codified at 18 U.S.C. § 1385 (2018)) explicitly restricts the use of the military for domestic law enforcement purposes. The Posse Comitatus Act embodies a core constitutional norm separating military from civilian space, barring the use of foreign troops in domestic settings, and forbidding insertion of uniformed military forces to police American civilian streets except in extraordinary circumstances. Trump’s proposed use of the troops would generally be barred under this law, unless there is a statutory exception.5 The most applicable statutory exception to Posse Comitatus—and the one that President Trump suggested he would use in his June 1 Claim—is the Insurrection Act. B. Text and Structure The Insurrection Act (presently codified at 10 U.S.C. §§ 251-54 (2018)) is a set of laws through which Congress has outlined specific conditions authorizing the President to deploy military forces to address domestic civil unrest. The four sections of the Insurrection Act outline the following conditions as exceptions to Posse Comitatus: ▪ Request by local official: Section 251 enables the president to deploy troops to cities when they are requested by a state’s legislature or its governor. ▪ Insurrection: Section 252, properly understood, enables the President to deploy troops to America’s cities to quell insurrections against the federal government, especially when such insurrections impair the functioning of the federal judiciary. ▪ Infringement of federally protected civil rights: Section 253, properly understood, enables the President to deploy troops to America’s cities in specific instances relating to the infringement of federally protected civil rights: most notably, when an insurrection is such that either (1) a state government is facilitating—whether due to intentional action or inability—the denial of equal protection of the laws to a class of its citizens; or (2) federal courts are unable to effectively adjudicate equal protection claims. ▪ Notice and order: Section 254 specifies that the president must announce his intent to use the troops and order the “insurgents” to peacefully disperse before deploying troops. The lack of a state-government request plainly bars Section 251’s application to Trump’s proposed deployment. But the inapplicability of Sections 252 and 253 merit further attention. To determine the true scope of presidential authority under the Insurrection Act, one must look beyond the Act’s text to the intended purpose of each section and the history of executive practice concerning these provisions.
(My comment:This is a long article. Skipping to the Conclusion section):
III. Conclusion Finally, it is worth noting that Senator Blumenthal has introduced a comprehensive reform bill in the Senate to reduce the ability of presidents inappropriately to deploy troops to America’s cities, and Representatives Omar, Jayapal, Pocan, and Escobar have introduced a “companion measure” in the House.38 In addition, the Center for American Progress has put forward four straightforward proposals to reform the Insurrection Act, specifically recommending (1) “Requir[ing] congressional notification and authorization”; (2) “Impos[ing] executive branch checks, including certification by the attorney general and/or the secretary of defense that conditions necessitate its use”; (3) “Add[ing] a judicial branch check and expedited review”; and (4) “Explicitly prohibit[ing] invocation against peaceful assembly.”39 While new clarifying legislation would be desirable, the foregoing analysis should make clear that the existing terms of the Insurrection Act do not provide legal cover for President Trump’s June 1 Claim. The Insurrection Act does not authorize any American president to deploy federal troops into America’s cities in the name of “restoring public order.” Rather than conceding to him such nonexistent legal authority, “We the People” should reaffirm that under current law, the President does not possess legal authority to deploy military forces against domestic protestors in civilian streets when such actions are taken: (1) over the objections of state governments; (2) unrelated to enforcing a court order; (3) outside the context of protecting civil rights, particularly when doing so would violate constitutional norms against military interference in civilian affairs, separation of powers, federalism, and Bill of Rights protections for free speech, assembly, right to petition, and right to vote
About the Authors Professor Harold Hongju Koh is Sterling Professor of International Law and former Dean at Yale Law School. He served from 2009-13 as Legal Adviser and from 1998-2001 as Assistant Secretary of State for Democracy, Human Rights and Labor at the U.S. State Department and from 1982-85 as Attorney-Adviser at the Office of Legal Counsel, U.S. Department of Justice. Michael Loughlin is a J.D. candidate at Yale Law School, where he is an editor of the Yale Law Journal. He received a B.A. in Economics from Harvard College. .
You are an endless source of interesting expressions (unless it was spellcheck)..-greenman
Yep, deep sneaks. Big trouble.
Posted by Sia on September 6, 2025, 9:56 am, in reply to "'Deep sneaks?' lol"
Having stepped into deep mud well over the top of your sneakers 👟 or shoes 👞 with a giant sucking sound as the mud claims your footwear and you are left with bare feet.
No doubt you remember that troublesome yuckiness from childhood?
I knew exactly who and what he was long before he rode down that escalator to make his bidding announcement. The prophecy of Fred Trump and Richard Nixon was coming true.
Timing of the Clinton accusations and investigations could not have been poorer or worse. Comey handed the presidency to the felon, and was rewarded by firing. The great firer struck again.
What disappoints me more is response of so many American people who seem determined to prove an inferiority of American education, growing up with no more common sense than to actually vote for this convicted felon, lifelong criminal and think they would receive anything but organized crime on an unimaginable scale.
Felon and Moscow Mitch armed the courts, and the felon owes this second presidency directly to Aileen Cannon who protected him dutifully. She brought all the experience of a lawyer who never tried a case, to the bench for life.
They weaponized SCOTUS who now owns the worst decisions and rulings in US history, none topping the grant of presidential immunity to first be tested by a convicted felon.
I protest and resist in every way I can, and confront MAGA with truth. You can look away from a painting, but you can't listen away from a symphony
There are people who have become so entrenched in their position that
they have lost all objectivity. I wonder if they even strive for it anymore.
I can more than understand how voters became totally fed up and frustrated with business as usual in Washington and didn't want to vote in the same ole same ole. What I don't understand is their solution.Be the change. . .
is rooted in eugenics. As did Hitler, many of them believe in a superior race or superior genes. Thus, if they cut off aid for the poor and sick, and cut funding for science, education, hospitals, vaccines, etc... they hope to weed out the undesirables... and then it will be 'heaven' on earth?
Yet many, if not most of their own weak and sickly will pay that price.
Humans are notorious for excluding themselves and their loved ones from negative outcomes, whether it's fate or caused by their choices. NO ONE wants to see themselves or their loved ones as susceptible to the "bad things" that happen to "other people".
A sign of real maturity is when someone recognizes that THEY are not exempt from the ramifications of foolish, bad choices.
That "better place" saying seldom actually helps those grieving unfathomable losses. At least when they allow themselves to actually feel their loss.
people will wise up before it's too late. The only good thing about the Trump administration is that they are so obviously on a fast train to disaster, and hopefully people will come out in droves for the midterms and vote accordingly. It would be truly gratifying to see even rural voters turn blue and put a stop to their destructive path, despite their redistricting efforts.
I too hope that the mid-terms will send a very loud and clear message to the
Posted by dancing digits on September 6, 2025, 1:34 am, in reply to "I truly hope that...." Valued Poster
train wreck that is Washington D.C. I can't say about other states, but that may be too much to hope for here in NY.
The state is very divided along geographic and party lines. The major cities are the voice of the state and Democratic by the majority. Upstate and in rural areas, life is rather different and needs are different too. People feel they have no real voice and are for the most part ignored. The upstate areas are heavily GOP. If one looks at the results of the general elections it is obvious that NY is very partisan and divided - so much so that upstate and rural areas want to split off from the cities.
I have my doubts that that will change. People are just so angry with each other that they are entrenched. People are not looking at the big picture - they are very focused on local issues.
And as you say in another response to me, there's just too much information out there to try and sort through it all to get to the truth of the matter. So much distortion and out right lies. . . one can spend a lifetime trying to dig for the truth and still come up short.
Be the change. . .
That is very common in a lot of states, with big cities vs more rural...
and for good reason. The needs are quite different, and the bigger majority cities usually take precedence when it comes to doling out the money... but people's perceptions are often way off.
For example, blue states and districts often support the red states and districts through federal tax dollars. Rural hospitals, education, roads, etc, are examples of where that money goes from blue to red districts and states.
The current administration just seems to want to cut anything and everything that doesn't directly benefit the rich or djt's cronies, and it will end up hurting the people who voted for them in the rural areas the most. But of course they won't tell people that. They will just continue to divide and conquer.
People who live in rural areas should realize that all of the modern day conveniences, entertainment, art, medicine, and niceties we all enjoy today would not be possible without the big cities, and the universities, grants and research, etc, etc, etc.
Why do we let politicians pit us against each other for their own gain and corruption?
I never thought about NY that way before, but it makes sense
Is he trying to "save" himself, or do the right thing?
There are many more invertebrates known collectively as MAGA, and some are showing signs of growing spines. Many are not.
Change for sake of change is a solution, but may be congressive instead of progressive.
In a way, the felon imitates climate change on an accelerated scale applied to politics, leadership, and federal policy. His base of MAGA mental, moral and ethical invertebrates can't resist the felon's weather and current, and are blowing along for the ride. The storm is destined for hell or oblivion, which are the same thing.
We may need to be grass, and let the storm blow over. The mighty oak... oaf, will topple in the wind, and we can help it. Resist its policy and don't be disenfranchised by its efforts to cheat and gerrymander.
Show up and vote like your life depends on it. You can't ride the felon's coattails for salvation, because he can't see you back there, and wouldn't care if he could. Vote to empower Congress to do its job, impeach and this time remove this cancer before it kills America.
He is the little felon who cries "Hoax!"
He is the hoaxter; the liar.
You can look away from a painting, but you can't listen away from a symphony
Trump will complete his term. In what condition this country will end up in is something that makes me shudder.
The only thing good I can say about all of this - some people will never learn until disaster hits them in the face. And if disaster is what it takes for so many to finally wake up - well, let's just hope the risk and consequences will be worth the lesson finally learned.Be the change. . .
My crystal ball says a brain hemorrhage will result in him stroking out in public while
his peeps insist that he's just fine and is recovering in style at the White House. Stephen Miller will take over the auto-sign pen full time to keep things running.
The felon was allegedly advised to confront accusations of mental decline
by doing and showing what he is good at. While he gets an F in foreign relations, tariffs, policy, support of the economy through policy, respect of state's rights, and many more officual responsibilities, his expertise in real estate led him to the renovations at the White House. He took out 150 year old trees and replaced them with the tallest flagpoles in DC.
He removed the Kennedy Rose Garden and had built a limestone slab patio like his at Mar a Lago, to remind him of "home." He is building a $100 million ball room nobody asked for or wants. Have you seen him dance?
He has plans to gut the East Wing snd first rebuild it, and then brand it with his name.
He is a renter. The White House is OUR property, not his, and he didn't ask permission to make any of these changes. You know as well as I, if a tennant makes changegs to a property without landlord permission, his deposit can be withheld, and he can be sued for additional costs to put the property back in original condition. You and I know claims of improvement and making a property better are no excuse.
The felon apparently has plans for rennovation of other DC Federal buildings, and even, god forbid, some of the parks and monuments. When done, like the East Wing, he intends to improve them by rebranding with his name.
He already rebranded the Kennedy Center. He is calling it the Trump Center. Again, no permission to do so. Most acts and performers cancelled their appearances there, and want nothing to do with it. So it will sit mostly empty, except for the talent the felon brings in, if you can call that talent.
He is trying to move in and take over 9-11 ceremonies in NYC.
His pit bull human Homan has National Guard poised in a Michigan air base ready to deploy to Chicago. Pritzger says the September intent is to frighten Chicago Latin community who traditionally have several major celebrations planned at that time. Homan said they're going in, and it may include troops. Pritzger said they're ready, and Homan responded with "Try and bring it on."
Stephen Miller is the architect for the Chicago timing, citing Chicago violence when the crime statistics show 2025 is at a 60 year low in the city. Miller called the stats fake. I wonder where he got that?
Long ago, Merlin said, "When a man lies, he murder some part of the world." The felon lies, Miller lies, Homan lies, RFK jr lies, Vance lies, Johnson lies, Abbott lies, and I don't mean little, occasional white lies or campaign promises.
You can look away from a painting, but you can't listen away from a symphony
I think that a lot of people are Constitutionally ignorant, or think that it's just something 'Liberals' use to trick them. They don't see themselves as having or needing Constitutional rights; they think that those are just wasted on criminals and foreigners.
They want things 'the right way' again, and think Trump will 'fix' them. They're alienated, and hate 'th' Libs.' Of course they've been trained like seals to do that by Repubs and the Rightist media for years.
We'll see whether they love the country enough to fight back eventually. I'm not holding my breath.-greenman
wanting their problems solved for them. They look to government for answers and to do it for them, and yet how many people say they don't trust politicians? They pray to their gods who are so absent . . . They ignore or seem totally ignorant of the fourth and most important power in the US - We the People. It is up to us to be the watch dogs, to safeguard the powers and rights that we have. It is up to us to put our foot down when the ideals this country was founded on are trampled over. We the People have fallen down on the job and quite sadly are part of the problem.
And it will be a hell of a fight to get those rights back if we loose them. But so many people are intellectually lazy, unwilling to admit the truth when it isn't pleasant, and are content to be fed whatever their favorite news outlet tells them or what rumor and spin have to say.
So many people as so entrenched in their position that they have abandoned any attempt at objectivity. They refuse to work with those who oppose them.
I hope we will come out the other side and have learned, but I don't know. . .history often repeats itself. Be the change. . .
Maybe part of the problem is that there is just too much info in today's world... and much of it is tainted with lies and half truths. Many people don't know what to believe, so they turn to some 'leader' or 'prophet' or 'God' or 'holy book' to put their faith in... as in the days of old when most people couldn't even read or know what to believe anyway, so they believed what they were told to believe.
A successful democracy depends on a free press and good information, with an educated electorate to be able to weed out the lies and misinformation. In this modern age, we are saturated with too much information to even sort through it. So, unfortunately, many people just choose what they WANT to believe... and with human nature being what it is, well... here we are. Some of it is laziness, and much of it is just selfishness.
Some want to go back to a time when life was simple, and you had a Walter Cronkite whom you could believe when he told you "And that's the way it is..." And some want to go back to a time when men were men and women were women and everyone knew their place.
When a black man and a woman ran for President, that was just more than some could bare to deal with. And when gays and such came out of the closet and began to be shown in a good light on TV as real people with the same rights and problems and legitimacy as other human beings... well, that was also too much.
So now we have a wannabe dictator who takes advantage of such human feelings and emotions, just as Hitler did, in order to elevate himself as the only one who can "fix it." And he very well may bring us to our knees, just as Hitler did to Germany. The difference being... we now have a crazy Hitler-wannabe who has access to the nuclear codes.
on September 4, 2025, 12:08 am
