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Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Dave on April 12, 2021, 11:11 am In the below picture, there is the then Princess of Wales, Princess Alexandra. Her attire depicts I believe the central portion of her Rundell tiara maybe affixed to two small collier necklaces. But what has really caught my eye is the large colored stones running down the central aspect of her dress. Are they the sapphires given to her granddaughter the Princess Royal, Princess Mary? Or are they the Kent Amethyst or could they be the Crown Rubies? The only jewels in the BRF fitting the size of those stones are the named stones mentioned above, so could they be more large sapphires in the vault we know nothing about? https://pin.it/376LTA5 Regards, Dave

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by fireweaver on April 12, 2021, 12:47 pm, in reply to "Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " I don't think the diamond surround matches the. Kent Amethysts and would she have been allowed to tinker with the rubies so much? Previous Message In the below picture, there is the then Princess of Wales, Princess Alexandra. Her attire depicts I believe the central portion of her Rundell tiara maybe affixed to two small collier necklaces. But what has really caught my eye is the large colored stones running down the central aspect of her dress. Are they the sapphires given to her daughter the Princess Royal, Princess Mary? Or are they the Kent Amethyst or could they be the Crown Rubies? The only jewels in the BRF fitting the size of those stones are the named stones mentioned above, so could they be more large sapphires in the vaue know nothing about? https://pin.it/376LTA5 Regards, Dave

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Beth on April 12, 2021, 7:25 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " The photograph of Queen Alexandra in fancy dress as Mary, Queen of Scots, was taken at the time of the Waverley Ball held in London in July 1871. In 1871 Queen Victoria, who was not noted for sharing jewels with her daughter-in-law, was alive and unlikely to give Alexandra access to the Kent amethysts. The so called Crown ruby necklace did not exist (with rubies) until after Victoria's death. I agree with Dave that Queen Alexandra was wearing the front element from her wedding gift tiara. She was wearing the upper portion of the earrings given to her by the City of London as a wedding gift. It looks as if some of the pearl and diamond elements from her wedding gift necklace are pinned to a velvet choker. Hanging from her neck is a pearl necklace with a diamond cross, the wedding gift from the Ladies of Liverpool. Across the bodice, the central section of the Dagmar necklace has been used as a corsage ornament. But what Queen Alexandra was wearing as a girdle and skirt ornaments is something which I can only guess at. But it is clear that not all the large gemstones are the same, and that are at least two different types. The only colour image from this occasion is the sketch done by Princess Louise for Queen Victoria, which can be seen on the Royal Collection site. Unfortunately, it is no help to us in identifying the jewels.

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Dave on April 13, 2021, 1:58 am, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " Thanks Beth for joining the discussion and pointing out the other pieces of jewelry.I thought of the two Russian Sapphire brooches but then I remembered they were both legacies of the jewel Queen, Queen Mary and the Albert Sapphire Brooch I believe remained with a heavy mourning Queen Victoria and the late QEQM Sapphire brooch gifted to PD would of been out of the question. Do we know of any large emerald stones in the BRF other than the ones had by QV? I saw an error I made in that I was identifying the former Princess Mary, Princess Royal as the daughter of Queen Alexandra and thinking that the sapphires the Princess Royal were given came from her Grandmother Queen Alexandra. But still could those said sapphires given to the Princess Royal could have originated from Queen Alexandra? Regards, Dave. Previous Message The photograph of Queen Alexandra in fancy dress as Mary, Queen of Scots, was taken at the time of the Waverley Ball held in London in July 1871. In 1871 Queen Victoria, who was not noted for sharing jewels with her daughter-in-law, was alive and unlikely to give Alexandra access to the Kent amethysts. The so called Crown ruby necklace did not exist (with rubies) until after Victoria's death. I agree with Dave that Queen Alexandra was wearing the front element from her wedding gift tiara. She was wearing the upper portion of the earrings given to her by the City of London as a wedding gift. It looks as if some of the pearl and diamond elements from her wedding gift necklace are pinned to a velvet choker. Hanging from her neck is a pearl necklace with a diamond cross, the wedding gift from the Ladies of Liverpool. Across the bodice, the central section of the Dagmar necklace has been used as a corsage ornament. But what Queen Alexandra was wearing as a girdle and skirt ornaments is something which I can only guess at. But it is clear that not all the large gemstones are the same, and that are at least two different types. The only colour image from this occasion is the sketch done by Princess Louise for Queen Victoria, which can be seen on the Royal Collection site. Unfortunately, it is no help to us in identifying the jewels.

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Dave on April 13, 2021, 2:46 am, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " You are correct about all the stones at her skirt not being the same, they are some clear/white colored stones oval or rounded in shape. Could they be diamonds' or due to light reflection maybe lighter colored stones such as aquamarine etc? But to me the skirt looks as if diamonds are inbedded in the v shaped elements. I also notice that the colored stones go all the way around to her waist like a kind of belt of sorts all intertwined in some very large shaped elements similar in design to her central tiara element on her head. If the white stones are diamonds, one wonders to what provenance they could have arrived as they appear to be very large stones, really big ones. I cant compare them in size with any of the large collect diamonds I can recollect as the collect diamonds look smaller, maybe the smaller stones noted could be compared with the collect diamonds, but what stones "diamonds" in the BRF can be compared in size to what has been noted in the picture? Regards, Dave. Previous Message The photograph of Queen Alexandra in fancy dress as Mary, Queen of Scots, was taken at the time of the Waverley Ball held in London in July 1871. In 1871 Queen Victoria, who was not noted for sharing jewels with her daughter-in-law, was alive and unlikely to give Alexandra access to the Kent amethysts. The so called Crown ruby necklace did not exist (with rubies) until after Victoria's death. I agree with Dave that Queen Alexandra was wearing the front element from her wedding gift tiara. She was wearing the upper portion of the earrings given to her by the City of London as a wedding gift. It looks as if some of the pearl and diamond elements from her wedding gift necklace are pinned to a velvet choker. Hanging from her neck is a pearl necklace with a diamond cross, the wedding gift from the Ladies of Liverpool. Across the bodice, the central section of the Dagmar necklace has been used as a corsage ornament. But what Queen Alexandra was wearing as a girdle and skirt ornaments is something which I can only guess at. But it is clear that not all the large gemstones are the same, and that are at least two different types. The only colour image from this occasion is the sketch done by Princess Louise for Queen Victoria, which can be seen on the Royal Collection site. Unfortunately, it is no help to us in identifying the jewels.

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Beth on April 13, 2021, 4:32 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " I very much doubt if the lighter coloured cabochon stones seen on Queen Alexandra's skirt are diamonds. For all that we know, some of the "jewellery" decorations might be costume items made from paste stones. Previous Message You are correct about all the stones at her skirt not being the same, they are some clear/white colored stones oval or rounded in shape. Could they be diamonds' or due to light reflection maybe lighter colored stones such as aquamarine etc? But to me the skirt looks as if diamonds are inbedded in the v shaped elements. I also notice that the colored stones go all the way around to her waist like a kind of belt of sorts all intertwined in some very large shaped elements similar in design to her central tiara element on her head. If the white stones are diamonds, one wonders to what provenance they could have arrived as they appear to be very large stones, really big ones. I cant compare them in size with any of the large collect diamonds I can recollect as the collect diamonds look smaller, maybe the smaller stones noted could be compared with the collect diamonds, but what stones "diamonds" in the BRF can be compared in size to what has been noted in the picture? Regards, Dave.

Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? Posted by Dmitry on April 13, 2021, 1:05 am, in reply to "Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " Remember that the settings of the Crown rubies were originally with opals, which Queen Alexandra apparently removed once she was queen. Therefore, the stones on her dress are unlikely to be the rubies as they were not yet set as such while she was still Princess of Wales. Previous Message In the below picture, there is the then Princess of Wales, Princess Alexandra. Her attire depicts I believe the central portion of her Rundell tiara maybe affixed to two small collier necklaces. But what has really caught my eye is the large colored stones running down the central aspect of her dress. Are they the sapphires given to her daughter the Princess Royal, Princess Mary? Or are they the Kent Amethyst or could they be the Crown Rubies? The only jewels in the BRF fitting the size of those stones are the named stones mentioned above, so could they be more large sapphires in the vault we know nothing about? https://pin.it/376LTA5 Regards, Dave

Princess Mary, Countess of Harewood sapphires Posted by Beth on April 13, 2021, 3:47 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " Dave raised an interesting line of questioning above, asking "But still could those said sapphires given to the Princess Royal could have originated from Queen Alexandra?" The origin of most of the sapphires worn by Princess Mary, Princess Royal and Countess of Harewood is known. As far as I know, no one has yet identified the earlier history of the large sapphire brooch, which could also form the centre piece of the large diamond tiara. Both the large sapphire brooch and the tiara are said to be wedding gifts from Queen Mary to her daughter. In the photo below the Princess is wearing Queen Victoria's sapphire tiara and necklace and the large sapphire brooch. The tiara and necklace were wedding gifts from her father, King George V. On very grand occasions the Princess wore the sapphire brooch as a centre piece of her diamond tiara. The sapphire corsage ornament is said to be Russian. It was a wedding gift from her husband. Some mystery surrounds the origin of the large sapphire in the diamond tiara. I very much doubt if it came from Queen Alexandra, who was alive at the time Princess Mary married and, as will be seen below, was still wearing what might be a large sapphire set in a border of diamonds. The large sapphire brooch was a wedding gift from Queen Mary. Detail from above When Princess Mary attended her first Court as a married woman in June 1922 she wore many of her wedding gifts including the tiara with the large sapphire from Queen Mary. Later in the same month Queen Alexandra undertook her customary drive through the city to assist with raising money for soldiers on Alexandra Rose Day on 21 June 1922. I suspect (but cannot prove) that the large dark coloured brooch at her neck was a sapphire. Queen Alexandra photographed on 21 June 1922. On his Instagram site Vincent Meylan has some good photographs of the sapphire Queen Mary gave to Princess Mary. He also has a very interesting (and I think convincing theory) that the brooch was recently sold. See Vincent Meylan https://www.instagram.com/p/CHno-2pFNOX/ Apart from the above, I don't think that the size, shape or setting of the items adorning Queen Alexandra's skirt at the Waverley Ball match the large sapphire belonging to Princess Mary, Countess of Harewood. Items from Queen Alexandra's skirt The first two appear to have cabochon stones and the third which appears to be a faceted stone is quite different.

Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara?? Posted by The Royal Watcher on April 14, 2021, 11:19 am, in reply to "Queen Alexandra as Princess of Wales/ Kent Amethyst /Sapphires or Crown Rubies??? " I think that the stones in Queen Alexandra's costume look quite similar to the stones in her Amethyst Tiara, which were not hexagons like the Amethysts in the necklace. Though we know that the Tiara was a Silver Anniversary gift from the Tsar and Tsarina in 1888, I wonder if the Amethysts might have been given to Queen Alexandra earlier?

Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara?? Posted by 992234177 on April 14, 2021, 1:22 pm, in reply to "Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara??" i think the sapphire necklace was the silver wedding present, which could be removed and put in place of the amethysts in the tiara. The tiara was separate. I assumed the tiara was an amethyst one that was adapted for sapphires but that might be a guess.

Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara?? Posted by Beth on April 14, 2021, 7:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara??" The sapphire necklace was definitely a silver wedding anniversary present to Queen Alexandra from her sister and brother-in-law, the Empress and Emperor of Russia. When I initially proved that the sapphire elements from the necklace were used in the tiara Queen Alexandra wore to her daughter, Princess Louise's wedding many were initially sceptical. Queen Alexandra in 1889 at the wedding of her daughter, Princess Louise. The tiara has the sapphire elements from the necklace given to her in 1888. There was no mention of a tiara from the Emperor/Czar/Tsar among the silver wedding gifts. Nor have I found such a reference later. To my way of thinking it is possible that either Edward VII or Queen Alexandra might have commissioned the tiara to take the sapphire elements. Edward VII, as Prince of Wales, was a wealthy man who could well afford to commission the diamond segments of the tiara. Perhaps, even Queen Alexandra would have afforded such a jewel. We know from Vincent Meylan's research published in Christie's. The jewellery archives revealed that, when the tiara, complete with amethyst elements, was auctioned, the auction notes stated, "The above lot was presented to Queen Alexandra by the Czar of Russia from whom it was bequeathed to HRH the Duchess of Fife." My questions would be -- Precisely what did the Emperor give to Queen Alexandra? The complete tiara? Or just the amethysts? Which Emperor are we talking about? Unless we have access to Queen Alexandra's jewel inventories or her now destroyed correspondence, I cannot see a way to say which of the two possibilities is correct. I tend to think that perhaps the Emperor gave her only the amethysts -- but?? My reason for thinking the latter is that I have never found a reference to Queen Alexandra wearing amethysts (and in particular an amethyst tiara) prior to the wedding of Princess Alice of Athlone in 1904. Prior to that, there are a number of references to the Queen wearing a sapphire tiara. From 1904 there are references to the amethysts, and press comments about how Alexandra favoured amethysts. While I cannot say that I have read every report available (so I cannot be 100% sure), it seems to me that Queen Alexandra didn't have the amethysts for the tiara prior to the time she became Queen and certainly not in 1871 at the time of the Waverley Ball. I know that there are limitations in being only able to work with media reports, but I suspect that, if Queen Alexandra had the amethysts earlier, there would be some earlier references in the press. The other thing which I think may be relevant is that giving amethysts as a gift was a characteristic of Nicholas II rather than his father, Alexander III. Perhaps Nicholas gave Alexandra the amethysts, which she then used in the existing tiara -- that is one possible theory. How I wish we could access the Queen's jewel inventory!

Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara?? Posted by Dave on April 14, 2021, 11:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara??" The discussion is a healthy one. I agree with Beth's assessment of the matter. Maybe we should pour over QA's wedding gifts which may have been documented again. The colored stones on QA's her skirt at the Waverly Ball are too significant to dismiss, and as I would have assessed before they go right around her waist and they are all large stones. Does anyone think that the late QA's dresses still make up part of the famous Royal Collection? And if they do, 'I wonder if a query lodged with that organization wont be able to say if the dress is still around and if it was indeed embellished with genuine stones? I do think that the stones are indeed genuine and stand out because of their size. To think that they could possibly make up a whole different set of unknown jewels within the BRF is really telling of the extent and depth of that family's collection. I have saved some more pictures with QA wearing some understated jewels of which I could have seen both the present Queen and her mother wore, but will give it some time to present them as another topic for another day. Regards, Dave. Previous Message The sapphire necklace was definitely a silver wedding anniversary present to Queen Alexandra from her sister and brother-in-law, the Empress and Emperor of Russia. When I initially proved that the sapphire elements from the necklace were used in the tiara Queen Alexandra wore to her daughter, Princess Louise's wedding many were initially sceptical. Queen Alexandra in 1889 at the wedding of her daughter, Princess Louise. The tiara has the sapphire elements from the necklace given to her in 1888. There was no mention of a tiara from the Emperor/Czar/Tsar among the silver wedding gifts. Nor have I found such a reference later. To my way of thinking it is possible that either Edward VII or Queen Alexandra might have commissioned the tiara to take the sapphire elements. Edward VII, as Prince of Wales, was a wealthy man who could well afford to commission the diamond segments of the tiara. Perhaps, even Queen Alexandra would have afforded such a jewel. We know from Vincent Meylan's research published in Christie's. The jewellery archives revealed that, when the tiara, complete with amethyst elements, was auctioned, the auction notes stated, "The above lot was presented to Queen Alexandra by the Czar of Russia from whom it was bequeathed to HRH the Duchess of Fife." My questions would be -- Precisely what did the Emperor give to Queen Alexandra? The complete tiara? Or just the amethysts? Which Emperor are we talking about? Unless we have access to Queen Alexandra's jewel inventories or her now destroyed correspondence, I cannot see a way to say which of the two possibilities is correct. I tend to think that perhaps the Emperor gave her only the amethysts -- but?? My reason for thinking the latter is that I have never found a reference to Queen Alexandra wearing amethysts (and in particular an amethyst tiara) prior to the wedding of Princess Alice of Athlone in 1904. Prior to that, there are a number of references to the Queen wearing a sapphire tiara. From 1904 there are references to the amethysts, and press comments about how Alexandra favoured amethysts. While I cannot say that I have read every report available (so I cannot be 100% sure), it seems to me that Queen Alexandra didn't have the amethysts for the tiara prior to the time she became Queen and certainly not in 1871 at the time of the Waverley Ball. I know that there are limitations in being only able to work with media reports, but I suspect that, if Queen Alexandra had the amethysts earlier, there would be some earlier references in the press. The other thing which I think may be relevant is that giving amethysts as a gift was a characteristic of Nicholas II rather than his father, Alexander III. Perhaps Nicholas gave Alexandra the amethysts, which she then used in the existing tiara -- that is one possible theory. How I wish we could access the Queen's jewel inventory!

Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara?? Posted by The Royal Watcher on April 15, 2021, 4:53 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara??" Thank You Beth for all your research! This makes a lot more sense! There are so many intriguing mysteries from Queen Alexandra's jewellery box. I really hope someone can get access to her inventories so we can find out more, similar to how we are finding out a lot recently of the Faberge pieces in her collection, which the RCT is increasingly making public, like in this talk from last week by Caroline de Guitaut, Deputy Surveyor of the Queen's Works of Arts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qy7IIYD_uq8

Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia Posted by Knightship on April 16, 2021, 2:02 am, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra Amethyst Tiara??" This news report from 1891 tells us that Alexandra received more than just the sapphire necklace from her sister and brother-in-law in 1888: The sables which the Princess of Wales wears upon a Court dress of sapphire velvet were the silver wedding gift given her by the Emperor and Empress of Russia, with the tiara and necklet of diamonds and sapphires, a truly imperial gift. 23 May 1891, Brighouse & Rastrick Gazette. Previous Message The sapphire necklace was definitely a silver wedding anniversary present to Queen Alexandra from her sister and brother-in-law, the Empress and Emperor of Russia. When I initially proved that the sapphire elements from the necklace were used in the tiara Queen Alexandra wore to her daughter, Princess Louise's wedding many were initially sceptical. Queen Alexandra in 1889 at the wedding of her daughter, Princess Louise. The tiara has the sapphire elements from the necklace given to her in 1888. There was no mention of a tiara from the Emperor/Czar/Tsar among the silver wedding gifts. Nor have I found such a reference later. To my way of thinking it is possible that either Edward VII or Queen Alexandra might have commissioned the tiara to take the sapphire elements. Edward VII, as Prince of Wales, was a wealthy man who could well afford to commission the diamond segments of the tiara. Perhaps, even Queen Alexandra would have afforded such a jewel. We know from Vincent Meylan's research published in Christie's. The jewellery archives revealed that, when the tiara, complete with amethyst elements, was auctioned, the auction notes stated, "The above lot was presented to Queen Alexandra by the Czar of Russia from whom it was bequeathed to HRH the Duchess of Fife." My questions would be -- Precisely what did the Emperor give to Queen Alexandra? The complete tiara? Or just the amethysts? Which Emperor are we talking about? Unless we have access to Queen Alexandra's jewel inventories or her now destroyed correspondence, I cannot see a way to say which of the two possibilities is correct. I tend to think that perhaps the Emperor gave her only the amethysts -- but?? My reason for thinking the latter is that I have never found a reference to Queen Alexandra wearing amethysts (and in particular an amethyst tiara) prior to the wedding of Princess Alice of Athlone in 1904. Prior to that, there are a number of references to the Queen wearing a sapphire tiara. From 1904 there are references to the amethysts, and press comments about how Alexandra favoured amethysts. While I cannot say that I have read every report available (so I cannot be 100% sure), it seems to me that Queen Alexandra didn't have the amethysts for the tiara prior to the time she became Queen and certainly not in 1871 at the time of the Waverley Ball. I know that there are limitations in being only able to work with media reports, but I suspect that, if Queen Alexandra had the amethysts earlier, there would be some earlier references in the press. The other thing which I think may be relevant is that giving amethysts as a gift was a characteristic of Nicholas II rather than his father, Alexander III. Perhaps Nicholas gave Alexandra the amethysts, which she then used in the existing tiara -- that is one possible theory. How I wish we could access the Queen's jewel inventory!

Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia Posted by Beth on April 17, 2021, 5:28 pm, in reply to "Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia" Congratulations on this wonderful find Knightship!! It certainly puts paid to one of my theories. And it makes sense of one report I found from 1888 which said a parure had been given along with the fur trimmed dress. It seems strange that none of media carried a sketch of it and that the main news outlets, like the Times, didn't mention it. The Times report Congratulations again! Your research has settled part of the queries I had. Now we have to try to work out when Queen Alexandra acquired the amethysts.

Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia Posted by 992234177 on April 17, 2021, 10:47 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia" Is the idea that QA was given sables, a diamond and sapphire necklace and an amethyst tiara because the article suggests it’s either a sapphire tiara or just diamond. Is there a possibility that there are diamond tiara inserts?

Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia Posted by Beth on April 18, 2021, 12:20 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia" I don't know the answer to this 992234177. My understanding would be that the sapphire necklace was presented with a tiara. Unless we find clearer descriptions or a sketch, it is difficult to say whether the tiara had alternate diamond elements.

Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia Posted by Dave on April 17, 2021, 9:11 pm, in reply to "Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia" I'm still somewhat confused as the dates of the Waverly Ball 1871 and the timing of the Silver Wedding anniversary 1891 is like some twenty years apart. Why would gifts meant for a silver wedding anniversary be given 20 years before the time? Is their two sets of jewels gifted at the separate times? And if they are jewels such as the fabulous ones we now pour over, one wonders if they are yet in the BRF's collection or had they passed to one of the descendant relatives? Its strange these types of stones were never seen or reappeared on any of the royals that we know of. Regards, Dave. Previous Message This news report from 1891 tells us that Alexandra received more than just the sapphire necklace from her sister and brother-in-law in 1888: The sables which the Princess of Wales wears upon a Court dress of sapphire velvet were the silver wedding gift given her by the Emperor and Empress of Russia, with the tiara and necklet of diamonds and sapphires, a truly imperial gift. 23 May 1891, Brighouse & Rastrick Gazette. Previous Message The sapphire necklace was definitely a silver wedding anniversary present to Queen Alexandra from her sister and brother-in-law, the Empress and Emperor of Russia. When I initially proved that the sapphire elements from the necklace were used in the tiara Queen Alexandra wore to her daughter, Princess Louise's wedding many were initially sceptical. Queen Alexandra in 1889 at the wedding of her daughter, Princess Louise. The tiara has the sapphire elements from the necklace given to her in 1888. There was no mention of a tiara from the Emperor/Czar/Tsar among the silver wedding gifts. Nor have I found such a reference later. To my way of thinking it is possible that either Edward VII or Queen Alexandra might have commissioned the tiara to take the sapphire elements. Edward VII, as Prince of Wales, was a wealthy man who could well afford to commission the diamond segments of the tiara. Perhaps, even Queen Alexandra would have afforded such a jewel. We know from Vincent Meylan's research published in Christie's. The jewellery archives revealed that, when the tiara, complete with amethyst elements, was auctioned, the auction notes stated, "The above lot was presented to Queen Alexandra by the Czar of Russia from whom it was bequeathed to HRH the Duchess of Fife." My questions would be -- Precisely what did the Emperor give to Queen Alexandra? The complete tiara? Or just the amethysts? Which Emperor are we talking about? Unless we have access to Queen Alexandra's jewel inventories or her now destroyed correspondence, I cannot see a way to say which of the two possibilities is correct. I tend to think that perhaps the Emperor gave her only the amethysts -- but?? My reason for thinking the latter is that I have never found a reference to Queen Alexandra wearing amethysts (and in particular an amethyst tiara) prior to the wedding of Princess Alice of Athlone in 1904. Prior to that, there are a number of references to the Queen wearing a sapphire tiara. From 1904 there are references to the amethysts, and press comments about how Alexandra favoured amethysts. While I cannot say that I have read every report available (so I cannot be 100% sure), it seems to me that Queen Alexandra didn't have the amethysts for the tiara prior to the time she became Queen and certainly not in 1871 at the time of the Waverley Ball. I know that there are limitations in being only able to work with media reports, but I suspect that, if Queen Alexandra had the amethysts earlier, there would be some earlier references in the press. The other thing which I think may be relevant is that giving amethysts as a gift was a characteristic of Nicholas II rather than his father, Alexander III. Perhaps Nicholas gave Alexandra the amethysts, which she then used in the existing tiara -- that is one possible theory. How I wish we could access the Queen's jewel inventory!

To try to clarify Posted by Beth on April 18, 2021, 1:06 pm, in reply to "Re: Queen Alexandra’s silver wedding gifts from the Emperor and Empress of Russia" I can understand your confusion Dave as the discussion moved on to trying to solve some other issues. Perhaps some dates will help. 1. Waverley Ball, which you initially inquired about, was held in 1871. 2. The Silver Wedding Anniversary was in 1888. 3. Knightship found a valuable 1891 reference in the press. That was significant as it solved the puzzle of who gave Queen Alexandra (and when) the tiara, which could take either the sapphire elements or the amethyst elements. Knightship's find showed that the tiara, as well as the sapphire necklace, was given to Queen Alexandra by her brother-in-law and sister (the Emperor and Empress of Russia) in 1888. Queen Alexandra wearing the tiara with the sapphire inserts in 1889. 4. Eventually, an amethyst necklace belonging to Queen Alexandra plus the tiara with amethyst elements and the sapphire necklace were inherited by Queen Alexandra's granddaughter, Princess Maud, Countess of Southesk. She wore the amethysts to the 1937 coronation. After her death all three jewels were auctioned. 1937 Princess Maud at coronation.

Re: To try to clarify Posted by Dave on April 18, 2021, 2:11 pm, in reply to "To try to clarify" Beth, I now call to mind a discussion which was had some time ago between Vincent, yourself and others about a purported amethyst tiara which was in the possession of the late QEQM. I think the discussion went that the former QM had gifted same to the then Duchess of York who had little to no appreciation for the stone and had either passed it to her late daughter Princess Margaret the Princess Royal or had sold it. Could it be that the provenance of that tiara had began with Queen Alexandra maybe via her Russian inlaws? Regards, Dave. Previous Message I can understand your confusion Dave as the discussion moved on to trying to solve some other issues. Perhaps some dates will help. 1. Waverley Ball, which you initially inquired about, was held in 1871. 2. The Silver Wedding Anniversary was in 1888. 3. Knightship found a valuable 1891 reference in the press. That was significant as it solved the puzzle of who gave Queen Alexandra (and when) the tiara, which could take either the sapphire elements or the amethyst elements. Knightship's find showed that the tiara, as well as the sapphire necklace, was given to Queen Alexandra by her brother-in-law and sister (the Emperor and Empress of Russia) in 1888. Queen Alexandra wearing the tiara with the sapphire inserts in 1889. 4. Eventually, an amethyst necklace belonging to Queen Alexandra plus the tiara with amethyst elements and the sapphire necklace were inherited by Queen Alexandra's granddaughter, Princess Maud, Countess of Southesk. She wore the amethysts to the 1937 coronation. After her death all three jewels were auctioned. 1937 Princess Maud at coronation.

Queen Alexandra v Queen Mary, amethyst tiaras Posted by Beth on April 18, 2021, 4:16 pm, in reply to "Re: To try to clarify" As far as I know Dave Queen Mary's amethyst tiara has nothing to do with Queen Alexandra. Franck is the one who discovered the eventual fate of Queen Mary's amethysts, so I hope he will explain it to board members. [PS Princess Margaret never held the title of Princess Royal] Queen Alexandra's amethyst tiara. Queen Mary's amethyst tiara

Re: Queen Alexandra v Queen Mary, amethyst tiaras Posted by Dave on April 18, 2021, 9:24 pm, in reply to "Queen Alexandra v Queen Mary, amethyst tiaras" Thank you Beth, maybe the BRF needs to create a new amethyst tiara going forward if they don't have any in the vaults. I always believed that the title of Princess Royal had devolved on Princess Margaret as being her sister would have been Queen, but thanks for clearing that up. I gather we will just have to accept that the stones displayed on Queen Alexandra’s dress in 1871 are a mystery. Regards, Dave. Previous Message As far as I know Dave Queen Mary's amethyst tiara has nothing to do with Queen Alexandra. Franck is the one who discovered the eventual fate of Queen Mary's amethysts, so I hope he will explain it to board members. [PS Princess Margaret never held the title of Princess Royal] Queen Alexandra's amethyst tiara. Queen Mary's amethyst tiara

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