Helpful, thanks (other than the coward shiv)* Archived Message
Posted by Carl Spackler on January 21, 2025, 20:08:03, in reply to "looking at ben johnson's offense and the bears (long)"
 Previous Message in simplest terms, they want to confuse the defense. "no shit, viv, everyone wants to do that." johnson really means it. he wants lots of things to look the same at the line, then have multiple options from there. in that way, it's very sean mcvay. but the next play, he'll throw a formation, a blocking scheme, a trick play, that you've never prepped for at you and hit you with a big play. he uses presnap shifting more than any offense i've ever seen to change strong side/ weak side and to get defenses off of their initial reads then also motions a ton at the snap to get his fast players already running at top speed and to create more assignment confusion. and he's really good at finding the weak link in the defense. first and foremost, this is an offense built on the run. he uses a lot of 3 tackle sets and 2 & 3 TE sets. it uses both zone (mostly outside) and gap/trap concepts. he will use any of his linemen to pull- sometimes 2 of them- sometimes even in opposite directions. i saw one play where he pulled the RT and the 3rd tackle playing TE on the right side towards the left, then had the LG pull the opposite way to create a cutback lane. but then the next play he'll run pure outside zone wide sprint for gibbs that they'll be able to exploit because the LBs and safeties just have to hold that extra beat to know where the ball is going. and of course, he uses a ton of play action off of all of these looks. goff really isn't a play-in-space guy, but they'd still do half rollouts. lots of levels concepts on those. for straight pass sets, they'll do a ton of motioning into a trips/bunch concept- again to create confusion- starting with 2 receivers to one side and sprinting a 3rd into that bunch so the secondary players have some assignment uncertainty. lots of deep middle and deep outside shots from these looks. dagger concepts with deep digs and sail concepts with deep outs. lots of verticals and posts. and because the TEs stay in to block so much, you'll also see a lot of block and release routes from them as outlets. they love speed at receiver and RB. get their fast guys in space, hopefully with a step or two on your confused ass, and let them take it to the house. so, how does this translate to personnel for the bears? -OL: going to need an overhaul and probably a multi-year one. because there is so much going on with so many different looks, you need smart players who know their assignments who are also athletic enough to do the pulling and moving required. adding kevin zeitler (G) who played in this scheme this year would be a great start. he turns 35 this offseason, so it would be a stopgap measure, but at least you wouldn't have a learning curve for him. you also need a real center. get me drew dalman. will campbell at pick 10 would also be really nice at the other guard spot. further down the draft, i really like tyler booker from bama as a 2nd round option, and luke kandra from cincy as a mid rounder. -WR: hopefully a coaching change revitalizes DJ into being the player we signed him to be. i can see him doing a lot of what ARSB does over the middle of the field. there isn't really a corollary to jameson williams and his 4.25 40 time on this bears team. rome has good speed but isn't a burner like that. maybe you take a chance on hollywood brown or rondale moore and their respective injuries histories in free agency, but i think you probably address this in the mid rounds of the draft. someone maybe like jalen royals from utah state in the 3rd. -TE: johnson uses the tight end for blocking much more than the bears did in '24. kmet is largely fine, but you're not bringing back gerald everett and i think marcedes lewis is about washed. you need to add at least 2 TEs. one free agent that really interests me is hunter long from the rams. he's a block-first TE, still on the young side (26), and familiar with mcvay concepts which we'd use some of, and you can get him for likely around the minimum. in the draft, you're probably looking later rounds. i've not looked much at TEs so far, but maybe someone like stayoutofitLukeLachey from TE U (UFI), jalin conyers from TTU, or mitchell evans from ND. just going on body types there. -RB: going to need some overhaul. there's a reason the johnson-led lions offense didn't mind trading away d'andre swift. you can't just cut him, though. you'd be eating $9M to save 500k. just won't happen- this offseason, at least. but after this year, he's probably gone. so let's say you want to recreate the "sonic and knuckles" gibbs & monty here in chicago. swift is more of the sonic side. not nearly as crazy explosive as gibbs, but you could use him in that role for a year. so where's the knuckles? ashton MFing jeanty. he's the idealized version of what you want for that role. elite tackle breaking and contact balance, always fighting for more yards, but also has some burst. he'd be a star. if a RB at 10 is just too rich for you (you coward), you could take cam skattebo, kaleb johnson, or quinshon judkins in the 2nd or 3rd. if you want the sonic role, i really like judkins' teammate treveyon henderson. he's so explosive in space. -QB: the biggest burning question of them all- how does this work with caleb? you'll see a lot of easy take "goff is a robot who can read the defenses quickly, caleb can't do that", usually from people already pot-committed on their "caleb is bad" takes. we only saw flashes of caleb being able to do this with lots of data points against it, but i think that has more to do with him not trusting the offense vs. not having the aptitude to do it. two very different things. i think caleb is really smart and can go through progressions well, just give him some time (both off the field and in the pocket). i don't think johnson takes the job if he doesn't see star potential for caleb. he turned goff from a bottom third QB to pro-bowl level and caleb has a lot more he can unlock. the last time i was this excited for the bears was probably 6 years ago. i genuinely think the future is bright.
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Message Thread: | This response ↓
- New thread for Bears (likely) final week of the coaching search (+poll) - gvibes January 20, 2025, 10:32:55 [poll]
- Oh no Liam Coen - OB25 January 27, 2025, 16:45:32
- That poor Weasley-looking MFer.* - SurfTheBoneyard January 27, 2025, 20:24:01
- Oh no Jerruh - tvillini January 27, 2025, 19:02:51
- I still love that the "T" in HITS stands for "the ball"* - gvibes January 27, 2025, 17:43:02
- I'll be honest I listened to Johnson only for like two minutes before he was hired - gvibes January 27, 2025, 17:42:07
- “Eberflus is not a person it is a mantle. When one is fired a new one must take its place.” - IlliniSax05 January 27, 2025, 17:29:56
- Finally figured out who this guy reminds me of. The redheaded Super Troopers guy* - Carl Spackler January 27, 2025, 16:53:36
- Pats hiring Thomas Brown as TE coach/passing game coordinator* - AintHatin January 27, 2025, 9:57:40
- Declan Doyle's dad was the Iowa S&C coach who gave a bunch of players rhabdo* - gvibes January 27, 2025, 9:38:26
- Dennis Allen is official, per Rap* - OB25 January 26, 2025, 18:59:33
- that’s good.* - Ari Gold January 26, 2025, 19:28:05
- Hightower back as ST coach* - AintHatin January 26, 2025, 19:09:17
- meh.* - Ari Gold January 26, 2025, 19:27:53
- Hell yeah* - illini21 January 26, 2025, 19:02:08
- And Declan Doyle as OC also being reported by Biggs* - OB25 January 26, 2025, 19:01:29
- Declan Doyle as OC per Biggs* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 26, 2025, 19:01:26
- This interview with BJ's agent, Rick Smith, is pretty good. He admits they were messaging the Bears - gvibes January 26, 2025, 12:27:50
- This mock is something - first one I’ve seen Milroe top 3 - MC January 25, 2025, 20:12:49
- On the topic of it being Abdul Carter or no one when it comes to edge rushers at #10… - OB25 January 25, 2025, 18:31:14
- Bears interviewing David Shaw now for OC* - Carl Spackler January 25, 2025, 13:51:03
- Man Jeremiah has Tyler Booker going to the Bears… at 10. Think we can write him off for round 2. - Carl Spackler January 25, 2025, 9:55:54
- This is why scheelhaase left for a lower title - snipes824 January 25, 2025, 9:02:20
- Dallas hiring Schottenheimer* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 24, 2025, 20:54:22
- Bears hiring Antwaan Randle El* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 24, 2025, 17:52:06
- Nevermind* - bbonb January 24, 2025, 16:57:15
- Noted
- Kajagoogoo January 24, 2025, 16:59:00- cosign* - bbonb January 24, 2025, 17:10:47
- autofill* - Illiniphil January 24, 2025, 18:53:16
- Nevermind* - Carl Spackler January 24, 2025, 13:23:21
- VIV, Chicago radio folks are still saying this morning that Fraley is the most likely option. - gvibes January 24, 2025, 12:40:30
- Bobby Slowik out in Houston. Life comes at you fast* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 24, 2025, 12:24:55
- wow* - illini21 January 24, 2025, 12:36:18
- Sounds like Ian Cunningham will be a target for the Jags in their GM search* - Carl Spackler January 24, 2025, 11:38:38
- Petey Carroll to LV Raiders. About the best hire they could make. * - MC January 24, 2025, 9:40:51
- 4 days later and I am still so damn excited about the Bears hiring Ben Johnson. - Carl Spackler January 24, 2025, 8:04:01
- Liam Coen to Jax* - Mrap24 January 23, 2025, 22:48:46
- Bears also requested interview with Daronte Jones from Vikes for DC spot - CanHartlebHireSnider January 23, 2025, 17:07:04
- I guess firing Baalke mattered. Liam Coen now back in play in Jacksonville - CanHartlebHireSnider January 23, 2025, 17:04:47
- mully & haugh mentioned something about allen going to detroit to work with campbell again?* - Ari Gold January 23, 2025, 12:40:35
- I was a bit surprised how optimistic he was about the current roster. - AintHatin January 23, 2025, 8:50:46
- We'll never know how things turned out if the hail mary against the commies hits the ground. Seeing - Warrin'_Illini January 23, 2025, 9:23:40
- This was a non-boob coach from an 8 win team, so doesn’t surprise me* - Carl Spackler January 23, 2025, 9:13:21
- I think there is a lot to like about the roster. The defense was definitely above average - CoronaTheirAss January 23, 2025, 9:09:26
- it's not that bad, way better than complete rebuild - apusikam January 23, 2025, 9:01:44
- meh, I doubt he really feels as optimistic about the roster as he sounded - IlliniSax05 January 23, 2025, 8:55:26
- Finally watched some press conference clips. - gvibes January 22, 2025, 23:24:28
- Just watched he presser. As VIV said, confident and prepared. So much more believable as a HC - LovetheChief January 22, 2025, 21:10:46
- Bears wanting to talk to Rams Assistant HC and Passing Game coordinator - DanSaint January 22, 2025, 20:30:57
- has anything else been reported on allen? - Ari Gold January 22, 2025, 19:56:11
- Oh my, the Jaguars are NOW firing Baalke* - OB25 January 22, 2025, 13:57:22
- Xs and Os video on Ben - VIV January 22, 2025, 13:04:16
- Aaron Glenn to the Jets per Schefter* - HamptonSki January 22, 2025, 12:56:11
- Caleb got Ben's number - CanHartlebHireSnider January 22, 2025, 12:50:25
- Sounds like the Bears won't get Fraley - UIHuskie January 22, 2025, 12:33:50
- shit.* - VIV January 22, 2025, 12:43:27
- So Bears-Johnson, Patriots-Vrabel, Jets-Glenn, Cowboys-Schottenheimer - CanHartlebHireSnider January 22, 2025, 11:47:49
- i have zero doubts that he’ll be able to lead a locker room - VIV January 22, 2025, 11:45:49
- st. brown super bummed ben left the lions and is going to make a big difference with the bears.* - Ari Gold January 22, 2025, 11:39:23
- Seems like the Cowboys are just promoting Brian Schottenheimer* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 22, 2025, 11:38:25
- home run hire* - Poldark January 22, 2025, 12:33:07
- Jerry is the best* - bjl63 January 22, 2025, 11:50:51
- lmao* - AintHatin January 22, 2025, 11:41:32
- somebody else for jerry to control?* - Ari Gold January 22, 2025, 11:40:10
- lolwat. just bring mccarthy back* - VIV January 22, 2025, 11:39:54
- Thank god no acronyms* - AintHatin January 22, 2025, 11:38:13
- Been watching this presser for 15 minutes and still don’t know what Italian dishes his wife can cook - OB25 January 22, 2025, 11:30:16
- Oh no, a John Shoop reference* - UIHuskie January 22, 2025, 11:22:24
- I am enjoying this quite a bit* - illini21 January 22, 2025, 11:16:36
- Johnson says he's been coming to Chicago the last 10 years to go to Cubs games - CanHartlebHireSnider January 22, 2025, 11:08:01
- Great article in The Athletic about Ben Johnson - VIV January 22, 2025, 10:31:55
- Liam Coen says no to JAX, staying in Tampa after getting a big raise* - HamptonSki January 22, 2025, 9:48:05
- Kiper mock draft - Carl Spackler January 22, 2025, 7:59:53
- Twitter acting like Fraley for OC is a foregone conclusion* - gvibes January 21, 2025, 16:09:42
- 11 am press conference tomorrow* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 21, 2025, 14:01:07
- very early projection of the bears offseason (long again) - VIV January 21, 2025, 13:52:32
- Plenty of bad coaches have fooled people by “winning” their initial press conference, but… - OB25 January 21, 2025, 13:41:59
- looking at ben johnson's offense and the bears (long) - VIV January 21, 2025, 12:17:51
- biggs thinks rizzi goes to work for payton again in denver; thinks hightower could be retained - Ari Gold January 21, 2025, 10:29:16
- Personnel sidebar: DeAndre Swift, OL attributes, WR3/4/5, CB2, TEs - Carl Spackler January 21, 2025, 8:18:58
- Kind of funny that 3 of Johnson's mentors (Shoop, Martz, Gase) are former Bears OCs - CanHartlebHireSnider January 21, 2025, 7:24:21
- which wideout has the best arm?* - Nobster January 21, 2025, 6:52:33
- Big Balls Ben: "No meddling by Warren, McCaskey." - longsnapper January 21, 2025, 6:19:57
- Man, what a turn. Did George seriously get hit hard by the "sell the team" chants or something? - gvibes January 20, 2025, 23:27:38
- Next big name to watch for the bears staff is Hank Fraley. OL guru* - VIV January 20, 2025, 19:08:49
- If I woke up with my head sewn to the carpet, I wouldn’t be more surprised * - meanjeans January 20, 2025, 17:29:48
- I like how some reporting is implying that we could have had him last year if we fired Flus* - gvibes January 20, 2025, 17:25:04
- Going out and making the effort to basically have a staff ready to go says a lot about Johnson - John Coctostan January 20, 2025, 17:05:39
- What is our contract guess? I'm going 65/5* - gvibes January 20, 2025, 17:03:52
- 6/100* - VIV January 20, 2025, 17:06:02
- Johnson’s agent tweeting it out - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 16:57:24
- Bears after Saints interim HC and former Saints ST guy Darren Rizzi for ST. - Carl Spackler January 20, 2025, 16:57:23
- For this to happen so quickly says one thing to me - AintHatin January 20, 2025, 16:48:34
- Ben traveling to Chicago tomorrow per Biggs* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 16:47:23
- Some fun Dennis Allen reading (pff warning) - VIV January 20, 2025, 16:43:34
- Anybody hear Olovsky’s observation on NFL live? (siap) - opossum jenkins January 20, 2025, 16:37:00
- Tom Grossi: Bears fans react to hiring of Ben Johnson - DanSaint January 20, 2025, 15:37:43
- the other thing is he comes from an aggressive hc and should understand the importance of a great ol - Ari Gold January 20, 2025, 15:15:40
- Hat tip to Poles/Warren here. Did not have Ben Johnson hired on the first possible day - AintHatin January 20, 2025, 15:11:10
- caleb ecatatic about the hire. so that’s good.* - Ari Gold January 20, 2025, 15:10:30
- Some reporting on Raiders/Jags - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 15:09:04
- What’s their salary cap situation like? - DT January 20, 2025, 15:03:49
- NM* - Carl Spackler January 20, 2025, 14:58:31
- Also Schefter who pushed back all week when the Raiders rumors were flying - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 14:54:23
- color me a little surprised. let’s hope he can do better than nagy.* - Ari Gold January 20, 2025, 14:52:09
- Holy fuck* - AintHatin January 20, 2025, 14:48:45
- Let’s goooooo* - John Coctostan January 20, 2025, 14:47:05
- Caleb and Carl should be happy. Both were pushing for Ben* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 14:45:42
- OVER THE DAMN MOON! - VIV January 20, 2025, 14:44:54
- Congrats Bears fans….now let’s see how my Raiders fuck this up* - OWWDig January 20, 2025, 14:41:57
- Schefter saying Dennis Allen like to be the DC* - Mrap24 January 20, 2025, 14:41:11
- Why is everyone so positive on him? Don’t see a great history of Ds there* - CoronaTheirAss January 20, 2025, 15:15:30
- Hell yes. GREAT DC hire* - Carl Spackler January 20, 2025, 15:02:24
- 3-4?* - Ari Gold January 20, 2025, 14:52:29
- That would be as good as you can ask for.* - OB25 January 20, 2025, 14:46:21
- that would be an A+ hire for a DC* - VIV January 20, 2025, 14:45:13
- Folks on NFL Live love that hire* - bjl63 January 20, 2025, 14:44:23
- Woooooot!* - illini21 January 20, 2025, 14:38:15
- Congrats Josina and Jonathan lol* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 14:38:03
- Congrats, Bears fans! You got your guy!* - voiceofreason January 20, 2025, 14:35:37
- SCHEFTER BOMB? * - MC January 20, 2025, 14:34:42
- For all your flight tracking needs - gvibes January 20, 2025, 14:19:50
- The Bears will be irrelevant with Ben Johnson* - KCWildcat January 20, 2025, 13:47:01
- “Ben Johnson deeply considering the Bears” per Josina Anderson - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 13:39:55
- Jets interviewing Newmark as well.* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 13:30:27
- “Lot of talk this morning of Johnson and Chicago” - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 12:51:49
- Sounds like Johnson is going to get to pick his GM in LV. That’s not good for Bears * - MC January 20, 2025, 11:41:46
- I picked Monken. Think it’s him, Johnson or McCarthy* - AintHatin January 20, 2025, 11:31:54
- 95/5 that we get stuck with mccarthy* - VIV January 20, 2025, 10:45:33
- I'm not sure why but i'm pretty confident they get Ben Johnson* - illini21 January 20, 2025, 10:45:30
- The fact that Johnson is catching some heat after getting too cute several times now - John Coctostan January 20, 2025, 10:44:41
- Eddie George* - CanHartlebHireSnider January 20, 2025, 10:33:50
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